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Post subject: Manual thread
 Posted: Jun 13, 2007 - 09:03 AM
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Joined: Dec 02, 2006
Posts: 121
Status: Offline
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I'm a translator of manual, so I belong to the group of people that know it really good. Often I see things which:
1. I don't like (e.g. too informal language, too technical instructions, instructions concerning very special application, too obvious information)
2. are not correct
3. I'd like to change (e.g. add some information)
4. I'd like to discuss
IRC isn't good for this ("These Australians always sleep"  )
So I started this thread
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For a good beginning:
1. We should standardize our notation of terms like fat (or FAT), dos (or DOS), gb (or GB), linux (or Linux) Very often you can find both forms.
2. From files I'm working on:
sys-admin-upgrade has almost the same content as sys-admin-apt (maybe add link referring apt?)
from term-konsole:
"Use wget to download it (hint: you can copy and paste file directly into your konsole window, after logging in as sux in console:
wget whatever-the-shell-script-is-called"
Why as ROOT ???? |
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Post subject: Manual thread
Posted: Jun 13, 2007 - 09:23 AM
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Team Member
Joined: Nov 24, 2006
Posts: 2643
Location: berlin
Status: Offline
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maslot,
good approach. the whole thing needs thorough proofreading, but i never get eaound to it.
greetz
devil |
_________________
>>we are sidux - resistance is futile - you will be assimilated<<
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Post subject: RE: Manual thread
Posted: Jun 13, 2007 - 11:03 AM
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Team Member
Joined: Nov 27, 2006
Posts: 1941
Location: underworld
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You could use axel instead of wget, you don't have to be root to use it (saves the file to /home)
Code:
apt-get install axel
example
Code:
piper@siduxbox:~$axel http://debian.tu-bs.de/project/sidux/release/sidux-2007-02-200705281503-tartaros-kde-full.iso
Code:
--max-speed=x -s x Specify maximum speed (bytes per second)
--num-connections=x -n x Specify maximum number of connections
--output=f -o f Specify local output file
--search[=x] -S [x] Search for mirrors and download from x servers
--no-proxy -N Just don't use any proxy server
--quiet -q Leave stdout alone
--verbose -v More status information
--alternate -a Alternate progress indicator
--help -h This information
--version -V Version information
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_________________
sidux uses high compression technology > special care is needed when burning the iso > please burn in DAO-mode, DAO or DIE. NEVER EVER do a apt-get upgrade or use adept, synaptic or aptitude
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Post subject:
Posted: Jun 13, 2007 - 12:16 PM
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Joined: Nov 26, 2006
Posts: 305
Location: Melbourne (VIC) Australia
Status: Offline
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maslot
You have another job
Draw up a list of standardised words to be used by the docs team
so that its becomes part of the editors-guide
linux vs Linux vs GNU/Linux
vfat vs FAT vs fat
blah blah
As for adding new topic , everyone can participate in that,
put in on the wiki , fully written up, or send an email to me of the topic fully written up, where upon it will undergo a peer review, prior to inclusion.
If its an addition to a topic, fully write up the addition, and post it in this forum.
As for other minor matters,, of say the sys-admin-upgrade file,, due to many users expecting to live-cd upgrade the file will stay as it is,, and helps drive home the point,, dont d-u in X
Re term-konsole , yes,, should have a an alt to reflect as user,, quite correct
The manual is firstly written, or tried to be written from a 'new user' point of view,, some topics do assume some level of expertise as they should,, this is a user operating manual,, This is not a sidux/linux developers manual.
Some topics are ""obvious" to someone experienced,, conversely often wtf to a new user. however a 'new user' is the first thought when a new topic is listed for inclusion, its not easy to keep a balance,
Great work and thinking
Regards
Trevor |
_________________
 When all else fails, get the instructions back out of the rubbish bin and reread them. E&OE http://manual.sidux.com/
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Post subject:
Posted: Jun 13, 2007 - 02:07 PM
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Joined: Dec 02, 2006
Posts: 121
Status: Offline
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piper wrote:
You could use axel instead of wget, you don't have to be root to use it (saves the file to /home)
You don't have to be root to use wget
bluewater wrote:
maslot
You have another job
Draw up a list of standardised words to be used by the docs team
so that its becomes part of the editors-guide
Nice try
Quote:
As for adding new topic , everyone can participate in that,
put in on the wiki , fully written up, or send an email to me of the topic fully written up, where upon it will undergo a peer review, prior to inclusion.
I know. I would do this, but I don't use english good enough. I'd like to suggest something, maybe author forgot about it?
Quote:
The manual is firstly written, or tried to be written from a 'new user' point of view,, some topics do assume some level of expertise as they should,, this is a user operating manual,, This is not a sidux/linux developers manual.
Some topics are ""obvious" to someone experienced,, conversely often wtf to a new user. however a 'new user' is the first thought when a new topic is listed for inclusion, its not easy to keep a balance,
let's be honest: sidux isn't for newbies. They should take an interest in Mandriva, Suse etc. I know that sidux is easier for users than debian, but this is debian, isn't it? |
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Post subject:
Posted: Jun 13, 2007 - 02:53 PM
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Joined: Nov 26, 2006
Posts: 305
Location: Melbourne (VIC) Australia
Status: Offline
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Quote:
By maslot: I know. I would do this, but I don't use english good enough. I'd like to suggest something, maybe author forgot about it?
It does not matter how good the english is, or how good any other language grammar is, its the intent , the idea, as you know, there are enough of us here to make a topic look not only good, but great.
Just saying we need a topic for xyz , is not going to cut it,, put the draft in place.
Regarding 'siduxand/or debian is not for new users', well,, nah not going to agree there at all,, I would agree if you said gentoo, however others (usually highly experienced with linux) find gentoo a breeze, so it has been said.
Quote:
By maslot: You don't have to be root to use wget
quite correct |
_________________
When all else fails, get the instructions back out of the rubbish bin and reread them. E&OE http://manual.sidux.com/
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Post subject:
Posted: Jun 13, 2007 - 04:09 PM
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Joined: Dec 02, 2006
Posts: 121
Status: Offline
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bluewater wrote:
Regarding 'siduxand/or debian is not for new users', well,, nah not going to agree there at all,, I would agree if you said gentoo, however others (usually highly experienced with linux) find gentoo a breeze, so it has been said.
OK. I'm newbie. (1) sidux hasn't detected resolution of my LCD. I was searching for clickable tool to change the resolution, but there is no such tool. In windows I just click on my desktop. (2) I have one of most popular adsl modem in Poland (Thompson ST330). Apparently it doesn't work in sidux. No idea what to do.
These are just two problems for newbie that can't be solved easily in sidux.
You take as an example gentoo. I think debian is very similar. You can find live-cd which makes installation as easy as in sidux. You have as good package manager as apt. You have as little administration tools as in sidux. In sidux you don't lose your time waiting till compilation ends. That's the difference.
P.S. Of course my LCD is properly set up and modem works - it's just the example |
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Post subject:
Posted: Jun 13, 2007 - 04:59 PM
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Joined: Nov 25, 2006
Posts: 449
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Quote:
OK. I'm newbie. (1) sidux hasn't detected resolution of my LCD. I was searching for clickable tool to change the resolution, but there is no such tool.
WRONG
Have you ever tried change-res under Utilities in the sidux menu? |
_________________
Why do strong arms fatigue themselves with frivolous dumbbells?
To dig a vineyard is worthier exercise for men.
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Post subject:
Posted: Jun 13, 2007 - 05:58 PM
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Joined: Dec 02, 2006
Posts: 121
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x-un-i wrote:
WRONG
Have you ever tried change-res under Utilities in the sidux menu?
No, I haven't.  Nothing about it in manual too
I just wanted to illustrate the idea: few clickable administration tools in debian (and in sidux). Compare this state to mandriva, fedora or suse. Of course someone can be lucky and have hardware with OS drivers and all his administrative activities will be running h2's script once a week. But real user has ATi, NVIDIA card, modem, wifi, webcam etc.
This reminds me that in sys-kern-upg and in whole manual there is nothing about downloading the source of kernel. It would be good to describe how to use module-assistant. |
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Post subject:
Posted: Jun 13, 2007 - 06:11 PM
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Joined: Dec 05, 2006
Posts: 476
Location: Venezuela
Status: Offline
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@maslot
http://manual.sidux.com/en/hw-dev-hw-dri-en.htm#mon-res
It is in the manual but it might not be obvious.
Once found it will do what you'd like.
Might make a good addition for the sidux control center. |
_________________
Nyx; 2.6.26-1.slh.4-sidux-686; Xfce, krusader
Last edited by Richard on Jun 13, 2007 - 06:59 PM; edited 1 time in total
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Post subject:
Posted: Jun 13, 2007 - 06:24 PM
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Joined: Dec 02, 2006
Posts: 121
Status: Offline
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from manual:
Code:
Changing the Screen Resolution
In a konsole as root
change-res 1024x768
or 1600x1200 1400x1050 1280x1024 1152x864 800x600
fix-res 1024x768
or 1600x1200 1400x1050 1280x1024 1152x864 800x600
Restart X by doing
ctrl+alt+backspace
Can you see here anything about clickable utility??? |
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Post subject:
Posted: Jun 13, 2007 - 06:56 PM
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Joined: Jan 10, 2007
Posts: 727
Status: Offline
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first click on konsole button
second klick to mark the text in the manual
third klick: middle-click to paste in konsole
then just press [enter](maybe there is also a clickable equivalent)
so it's all very easy and completly clickable 
p.s: with siduxcc in next release, there will be much more clickable utilities run out of the box. |
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Post subject:
Posted: Jun 14, 2007 - 07:39 AM
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Joined: Dec 02, 2006
Posts: 121
Status: Offline
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In vir-rkits:
- downloading with wget as root
- chrootkit: describing every library in package, but no word about how to actually run it
- it would be nice to add which virus/rootkit scanner is more effective |
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Post subject:
Posted: Jun 14, 2007 - 12:28 PM
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Team Member
Joined: Nov 27, 2006
Posts: 1941
Location: underworld
Status: Offline
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piper wrote:
You could use axel instead of wget, you don't have to be root to use it (saves the file to /home)
You don't have to be root to use wget
So sorry that i misunderstood you at 05:03 AM with wget (yes, before the coffe was made and the birds were up)
"Use wget to download it (hint: you can copy and paste file directly into your konsole window, after logging in as sux in console:
wget whatever-the-shell-script-is-called"
Why as ROOT ???? |
_________________
sidux uses high compression technology > special care is needed when burning the iso > please burn in DAO-mode, DAO or DIE. NEVER EVER do a apt-get upgrade or use adept, synaptic or aptitude
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Post subject:
Posted: Jun 18, 2007 - 07:49 AM
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Joined: Dec 02, 2006
Posts: 121
Status: Offline
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sys-admin-apt:
Reasons to not use package managers to dist-upgrade - the reasons are false because managers are just frontends to apt, they don't do any dependency calculations or other operations. All of them can show output of apt.
The real reason - which isn't mentioned - is they require init 5 to work which in some circumstances can break dist-upgrade. |
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